What's it worth?

I get asked all the time what something is worth and thought I would try to share soem of my experiece regarding the subject here.

As the old adage goes, "it's worth what someone is willing to pay for it". This has always been the case with anything someone is trying to sell. If you have the time and expertise, you can get the maximum value for just about anything. If you have to sell quickly or without all the facts, you will not realize the absolute highest value.

Having said that, here are some facts you should know if you will be selling any scouting collectibles:

1. Age does not necessarily mean value. Most of the boy scout related books from the early 1900's while very old are not worth more than $5 - $10. However, there are early handbooks that could be worth several hundred dollars. Same for most of the National Jamborees. Aside from 1935 and 1937, most Jamboree stuff is very common. I had someone contact me with a group of 1964 National Jamboree stuff recently that included all the standard items: Jacket Patch, Pocket Patch, Neckerchief, Leather, etc. This person thought the group should be worth several hundred dollars as it was 40+ years old. I tried to explain that 1964 and the other Jamborees from that era were very well attended and everyone purchased 2 or 3 of all these items so they were easy to find and hence not worth more than maybe $50.

2. Coffee Mugs are almost worthless. I tell anyone who asks to either drink coffee out of them or use them for target practice. (I know that's kind of harsh, but it's true)

3. Equipment has a limited audience. Canteens, Backpacks, Messkits, First Aid Kits, Belts, Firestarting Kits, etc. While interesting, these items are also numerous and unless they are in perfect Mint condition, have a relatively low value. One exception is Pocket Knives and Axes/Hatchets. As these were made by several different makers, some are highly collectible and very hard to find. I once sold an Axe with a Philmont logo on it for $600. Another exception would be things that are still in their original box. These are worth considerably more than those without a box.

4. The Boy Scouts are great marketers and have put the BSA logo and emblem on just about everything over the past 90+ years. This means there is literally tons of stuff out there. Something can be very plain and innocuous, but be very collectible. An example in my collection is a pair of official Boy Scout Gloves. I've never seen a pair of these forsale so I have no idea what kind of price these would bring. I'm chossing to keep them in my collection for now and actually have them on display in my office. Another item I came across recently is a boy scout lightbulb. A regular lightbulb with a large first class emblem embossed on it. Very cool and probably very collectible. I would bet it's worth at least $50.

5. The Internet has actually brought the value down on some items. For a variety of reasons, some items have actually gone down in value in the past 10 years. Take a look at eBay and watch what stuff sells for. A Philmont arrowhead can be had now for as little as $15. These used to sell for at least $30. Many Order of the Arrow items are also down from their peak a few years ago. A few more reasons might be: Several large collections have hit the market, all the serious collectors have completed their collections, new collectors don't have the funds to spend, and there aren't as many new collectors as old ones selling things off.

6. Earned vs. Attended vs. Awarded. This is another conversation I have on a regular basis about various items. Things you earn like rank or merit badges are much more common than say items you get for attending a Camporee or Summer Camp. Even rarer are those items that are Awarded like the Silver Beaver, Silver Antelope, Silver Buffalo, or Lifesaving Medals. As with most things there are plenty of exceptions. For example, a Square Aviation merit badge from the 1920's is a rare item that should be worth around $200. A square Cooking merit badge from the same timeperiod might be worth $5. Not as many people chose to earn Aviation while most everyone had to earn Cooking. While everyone who went to summer camp in a given year was eligible for that years camp patch, many were sewn or lost so a given year's camp patch might be worth alot of money. Now if your camp had thousands of campers, then there are obviously more available so the value would be less. Those items that are awarded (which means no matter how bad you want them, you have to be recognized by someone else) are also highly collectible. The Silver Beaver which is one of the most common awards can range from as little as $50 to several hundred depending on which variety it is. In this case, the older ones are worth more.

7. Variety is the spice of life and can also be the difference between a common item and a really rare item. An example is the Tenderfoot rank pin. There are at least a billion of these in existence (ok, maybe not a billion, but certainly millions). For the most part, this pin has not changed over the past 90+ years so it has relatively little value. One exception is the one that was made by the T.H. Foley company of New York, New York. T.H. Foley only made the Tenderfoot pin for a few years in the teens. This variation is worth around $100. The rest might bring a buck.

8. Condition is everything. It goes without saying that an item that has been glued, stapled, sewn, washed, or damaged in any way will be worth less than one that is in excellent condition. An example might be a nice Order of the Arrow pocket flap from a small lodge in the 1950's. Some of these could be worth $1000 in excellent condition while one that has been sewn and washed might only be worth $100.

9. I will pay sky high prices for something I really want. I believe this is true for most collectors. Regardless of what the market might say something is worth, if it is something I really really want, price is not an issue. A recent example would be a Kaw Council neckerchief that recently showed up on eBay from the 1960 Jamboree Contingent. As I collect all things from Kansas and had never seen this item before, I was determined to add this item to my collection. It started out at $20. I won it for just over $100 and was ready and willing to pay double that if I had to. What does this mean? If you have something from the state of Kansas, you should call me :)

10. Priceguides are just a guide. There are numerous price guides that have been published and I buy them all. They are great references and will help in indentification and for the most part give you a general idea of values. However, they are usually one or two peoples opinion of value and should be taken with a grain of salt.


There are exceptions to every rule, but I hope this might help you a little when you decide to sell your scouting collectibles.

What to Keep?

I was recently contacted by someone who inherited their grandfather's scout stuff and while talking to them about it, they asked if they should keep anything. I pondered this a moment as I haven't given that topic much thought until now.

My response to this person was that I would keep those items that clearly meant something to their loved one.

In my own collection, I have most all of my grandfather's and father's stuff, but if it came down to only keeping certain items, I would probably choose things such as:

My grandfather's scoutmaster collar brass from the 1950's. He was Scoutmaster for Troop 95 in Roeland Park, Kansas for many years.

I have both of their official shirts that are pretty well decorated. I could never part with them.

There are some photo's of my dad as a scout that I feel need to be kept.

Most of their patches are fairly common so if I had to get rid of them, I could without losing much sleep. Same goes for the neckerchief slides, coffee mugs, handbooks, and equipment.

I'm a collector and probably have a different viewpoint than someone who isn't. I guess anything could be meaningful to anyone?

Mt. Baden Powell ?

I've never heard of this mountain until today when I found a Dedication ribbon and button for the naming of Mt. Baden Powell on May 30, 1931.

There is a nice Wiki page here

A great example of a local council badge from California.

Thoughts on eBay

I received an email recently from eBay about their upcoming price changes that caused me to pause. For a number of reasons, I have cut way back on listing items on eBay over the past couple of years, but now I'm thinking about cutting back even more. Their fees for lower dollar items just don't make sense anymore and the whole feedback system is a mess. Now sellers won't be able to leave a negative feedback for a bad buyer. Frankly, I've been concerned with the number of listings in some categories as being too many. Buyers have to wade through pages and pages of stuff that takes too much valuable time. I might add that I'm only speaking about the collectibles categories as they are the ones I have the most experiece with.

As a seller, eBay hasn't been producing the kind of results I've been used to in the past. Don't get me wrong, I will still list items on eBay from time to time, but it will primarily be a marketing venue for me.

The majority of items I decide to sell will be on http://www.manions.com or the List It Yourself site at http://auctions.manions.com both of which I happen to own. While we have been primarily a military collectibles auction in the past, I hope to grow some other collectible categories as sellers (myself included) become increasingly frustrated with eBay.

Prototype OA Flap

I recently acquired a cool Order of the Arrow flap from Owasippe Lodge 7 out of Chicago that appears to be a Prototype made in Japan. This comes directly from Osaka where someone recently bought out Hashimoto & Co. Ltd a family owned business that was started in the 1940's.

It appears to be a F3 or F4 but has different Fingernails than either of those. When I initially saw a digital picture of this patch, I thought it was nothing special, but upon viewing it in person, I immediately noticed the asian style embroidery of all the letters. The back is also unusual.

The flap comes with the original sample tag but unfortunately, there is no date.

If anyone has any information on why this patch might have been made, please feel free to post a response.

Dallas TOR

Just returned from the 2008 Dallas TOR. Another great event put on by Ron Aldridge and Dave Thomas. I apologize if I'm leaving anyone out here.

Although I didn't buy much this year, my sales were very good. The best part was without question, seeing other collectors, learning what they collect, seeing some very cool items, and conversing about the hobby. If you haven't been to a TOR, I would suggest you find one close and make an effort to go. Dallas has always been a positive experience for me. (Even with the theft I experienced last year)

While I didn't get a chance to attend any of the seminars, I'm sure they were informative as well.

St. Louis Trade-O-Ree

Just returned from the St. Louis TOR. I haven't made it to St. Louis in a few years and was glad to get back.

I was able to pickup a nice little pile of items for my collection including:

Several St. Louis camp and activity items
1950 Los Angeles Area Council JCP Troop 8
2 Shawneee Lodge Activity patches
Some new 429 Dzie-Hauk Neckerchiefs
A nice 1967 World Jamboree Pennant
The highlight was a 1953 Kansas City Area Council Contingent Jacket

John Remelius puts on a great show and if you get the chance to go next year, I would highly reccommend it.

The location was a little catholic church hall that was a perfect TOR location.